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Yes I have had a rash of '' Can we have your updated CV and expected dayrate' calls... Not too many replies.. Guess I'm too expensive.. Oh well another Month enjoying the 'life of the rich and famous'

Much more of this lifestyle and I might just say bugger it and not bother going back... Early retirement beckons... Can always do a trip sometime in the future when rates perk up... Maybe even sign on for a few Months .. lol
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Turtle,

I cherish that day when one of the many companies get themselves stuck because Johnnie - one - year - wonder - supervisor gets to a point of losing a contract. One of the, "Ummmm..... can you help us out here?" phone calls where you can say, open the vault laddie! You are gonna pay through the gazoo!

Djan,

I'm green!!!!! Mr. Green
I got your economic downturn right here!!!
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Unionisation??? Solidarity??? It will never happen!!!
The Rov industry has been going for well over 25 years now and what has come out of it?? NOTHING!
You have had your chance and you've blown it!!

Most guys and i say most, have a technical qualification. You are technicians, you are skilled.When you join the Rov industry you spend a few more years in what amounts to be another apprentiship.
You are one of the few departments on a vessel that mobilises your own equipment, maintains your own equipment, repairs your own equipment ,operates your own equipment and eventualy demobilises it,in all weathers i may add, but still you are called Rov operators, not technicians or engineers and paid poor rates.WHY?

You accept poor food, poor accommodation, hours sometimes days of travel then straight onto shift...fatigued or not.Why?

A lot of work has moved to undesirable places and the uplift for the poor and dangerous conditions is being removed, and do you accept it? yes!Why?

Because the companies have got you exactly where they want you.

Ask youselves who did this damage?
You had the chance to develope this industry and move it forward and demand a premium like the divers but the i'm alright jack mentality prevailed over the years and now the price is being paid.

Have you got a leg to stand on or a hope in hell of changing things?NO

The few individuals who are refusing to work waiting for the rate to improve...good on you.

I have been in this industry a long time now and i'm glad that my time is coming to an end. I only see the equipment improving not the attitude of the guys or the rates and nothing is going to change this.

I personally have never had a problem with work through any offshore recession. There will be natural wastage again but it certainly will not be the guys who can do the job or the older operationaly experienced guys.

If you think being unionised will solve your problem then dream on.
The divers have done a brilliant job,but the Rov guys missed the boat.

So sort it or stop bleating.
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De-mob,

Is the definition of your "handle" cease and desist the mob?? Well, you're correct! THERE IS NO MOB. There are to many "I'm alright Jacks". And you have mirrored my sentiments to the "T". Still not ONE PM to me concerning a Yuni0n....
I got your economic downturn right here!!!
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I 've commented on this subject many times from contractor to staff position and always from Alright Jack!

I think we need to get away from the diver comparison altogether:-

You do not take a phone call and say yep I'll go do your SAT job for you £X per day blah blah because you dont have any certs prob dont dive any way and the buisness is way smaller than ours and is rare for somebody not to be known!

Where as and still happens
"Get me another cheap Monkey out of the Box for this crap Job"
This is why each guy protects his job or dayrate or does whatever it takes, stabbing in the back, get rid of this or that Nationality etc etc to survive!!

When and only when we can police none techs too many trainees been sent from the beach to the system from my point of view will we stop the alright Jack attitude because we would then be responsible for team member choice and effectively cut out un-vetted new starts.

So until that day happens you will see Ex pats protecting themselves from Poles/Indians/philipenos/Russians etc etc. by whatever means they can, they dont have the time or world wide power to ever make it a reality. So most Sups protect their own little fifedom with similar Guys and good techs where they can!!

Oh 20 years in and in the Uni0n for the legal aspect realy and try to avoid the North Sea if I can as I've done my long cold apprentiship there!

Three Musketiers Ha forget it....!!!
It's always a short/water in the whip not the equipment! Now start snipping them tywraps and I'll mix the 3M Scotch cast.
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Like James Mc said, there are 2600 reads and only 54 replies. That speaks volumes to me about the solidarity and the amount of airight jacks around so Scotbeve i would if i were you just chill and laugh at the mugs as you enjoy life and a cool beer.
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Currently

Views: 3452

Replies: 73

Or to put it another way... 2.1% of the total views resulted in a response Sad



74 replies now I guess, but the point has been made.
James Mc
Site Admin
www.rovworld.com

Shocked Search First - Ask questions later Thumb Up
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The breakdown..

3000 Wannabees and Trainees..

400 blokes waiting for work at home.

50 blokes offshore on crap day rates and keepng quiet about it

2 Ops managers rubbing their hands...

Laughing
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De-mob wrote:
Like James Mc said, there are 2600 reads and only 54 replies. That speaks volumes to me about the solidarity and the amount of airight jacks around so Scotbeve i would if i were you just chill and laugh at the mugs as you enjoy life and a cool beer.


De-mob,
MY days of laughing are gone... now is the days of constant drooling and lots of mumbling to myself. I occasionally check myself into the psyche ward and get myself an MRI to see the ever-depleting grey matter.

JB,

I guess you'll remember the days where we were to "micro-mange" our "own" systems (yes, I know, I don't like those terms either) by the upper orifice wallies... We didn't have: proj. mis-manangers, tech. support, etc. etc. Job creation and less getting done efficiently... Those days, I believe, were a bit tighter as far as the work teams were concerned.... Mind you, a lot less people in the industry as well. Eg; there were.... 2 count them...2 ROV guys in Oz in 1982. My point is, yes, there is NO solidarity in this industry... Agreed 100%.

So... to stay on topic... a quick sum of the above posts, we have: GREED on the top of the list, zero solidarity, too many guys in the industry, and a lot of inefficiency.

I'm counting my days left.....
I got your economic downturn right here!!!
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If anyone is willing to pay rate for experience, please pm here
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I think the point JB is trying to make is the same as the one I put forward in the onion thread last year.

There should be no comparison with the divers. In what way is the ROv industry like the dive industry other than they both deal with work underwater?

Divers work in a physically demanding and very dangerous enviroment. What we do is technically demanding and very much knowledge based.

Divers need variuos specialist courses and tickets to be allowed into a sat chamber. ROv dudes need to be able to walk upright (mostly) to be allowed onto an ROV spread.

Their uni0inisation worked because the companies couldn't turn around and replace anyone in the onion with some bod striaght out of the dole que. Uni0nisation of the rov industry wouldn't work because 6 rov wannabees can be found in about 15 seconds.

So lets drop all this comparison with the divers. It's like comparing us the drilling industry. Completey irrelevant.
I was in the pub.
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The only reason they are able to 'replace' guys with newer cheaper numpties straight out of the box.. Is because we have been daft enough to train them.. I agree the industry needs trainees but not at the expense of experienced hands.. They should be out as a 4th man and not misrepresented by the office as an experienced P/T so they can skim the dayrate. All of us have had to cover for these guys.. fixing and flying the sub for extended hours and keeping quiet about their lack of ability.
It's fine when the new guy is keen, smart and a quick learner.. Unfortunately they seem to be few and far between.. Now there are too many apathetic and surly know-it-alls getting offshore.. Keen to work for cheap and keen to get up the bosses arse to keep their job..

Running them off used to be the norm if they didn't pull their weight or fit it.. When was the last time you heard of a newbie being R/O or NRB'd recently ? It never happens now the office tells you stop whinging and put up with it..

They value these blokes more than their experienced core... Be interesting to see how well they'd do if the exp guys stopped covering for them and let them wreck havoc with the gear...
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The diving comparison is relevent if you compare your rates.
LSS, LST, ROV and stby diver Rates were very close in the 80s and divers were queing up to get into Sat where the big money was. Point is, diving declined and Rov demand grew but the rates didn't Why? Maybe you experts can answer that one. Lacking Solidarity, uni0n?????

Most drilling crew or diving crew can be recruited easier than finding a good technical bod for Rov's.
Last i heard, was that an LST course was 6 weeks with no technical quals required, Diving also a short course?? where as a mechanical or electronic HNC or degree is 3 years graft, an apprentiship 3-4 years. Yes i agree that diving is dangerous but they are rewarded well when in the bin for the danger...still i wouldn't do it. The plot has been lost here though. The point was, and it doesn't matter if you use diving, drilling or scaffolding rates. The rov rates are crap in comparison and so is the attitude from the desk fliers towards the people doing the job.

Considering you are supposed to be a technically qualified group of people, I think that a lot of guys out there have killed the job by accepting any shite over the years and being alright jacks.

Carry on boys accepting jobs in dodgy places and on dodgy vessels with dodgy food for the rates you are offered by dodgy ops managers if it's acceptable to you, because as the replies prove, you will never be united behind a uni0n to sort the conditions out.

LET THE SUPPOSED RECESSION TAKE IT'S TOLL ON RATES! no one seems to mind.
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For the sake of around 15 GBP a month we can all afford to join the union!!! Join up below....

http:/www.rmt.org.uk

http:/www.oilc.org


Last edited by Kalbo on 16:52 Sun 26 Apr 09; edited 1 time in total
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Thought i had better up the percentage of views to comments, so here goes:-
I agree with ROVnumpty - ROV and divers are totally different cases. Divers have to do an industry recognised course to work and our trainees have to just be in the right place at the right time. If they have completed 6 mins on the sticks somewhere and come with an IMCA recognised cert then all the better, as far as the offices are concerned, as they can then show the client that their workforce is competent! (rightly or wrongly!)
I have been working with ROVs for 13 years now, with both fruitful and barren times - it is to be expected as everything in this life is cyclical - fashion, politics, music and yes, economics. Companies are always 'improving efficiency' and 'trimming costs' - this is nothing new.
As for onion membership, i think it is a personal choice and no one should feel 'bullied' into leaning one way or the other. I have done less work this year so far than recently but my rates have been good, so no complaints from me..... at the moment lol.

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