Undercutting the going rate to get work for yourself?

There has been some discussion about this, in another thread, and I feel it warrants it's own thread so that the idea of offering to go out cheaper than the going rate, just to get a foot in the door, can be fully debated and the point rammed fully home to those that may consider this option as acceptable practice.

My message for those that feel, out of desperation or whatever, they might wish to go out cheap is..... Do not offer to do it.

You would not be doing yourself, or other people in the ROV industry, any favours. The only ones that benefit in the longer term are shareholders of the companies that you work for.

If you have to, do what I did years ago and take a driving job or something until the right job at the right rate comes along.

best regards
James Mc

Member Joined: Dec 15, 2008

replying to the last thread before James have locked it, Lostboy, thx a lot for the useful info. , thing is I’ll be taking the course on the 16th of Feb. at The Underwater Center in FortWilliam, hope it would make me an advantage at last especially that I graduated from a 5 years college, of electronics and communications department, so I’m trying to survey the market starting now to have a clue on how this business goes, and about accepting jobs on the weekends , I have no problem at all with this, I’ll even be more glad if i managed to make some friends in this industry to help each other out through the journey , I know practically it isn’t that pretty looking, but it’s we who can either force it to be pretty enough and suit us well, or make it as miserable and pessimistic as we wish, it’s our call at last, that’s my humble way of thinking, and to James, your absolutely right, if we started accepting cheap day rate jobs we’ll end 50 dollars a day or even less, the cheaper the bitch the more worst you treat her, but as I’m still taking my very first baby steps into this field ,what is the minimum accepted trainee day rate ?!

Member Joined: Mar 17, 2005

mido wrote:

the cheaper the bitch the more worst you treat her

Classic

Member Joined: Jun 05, 2004

Refering to the previous thread on what to do Mido ,
Answer............................................
Write to the ROV companies and send your C.V to them , Ring them up once a week asking if there is a job available. Move to a location where the ROV companies are based so that you keep the travelling expenses down to a minimum for yourself and the ROV company , Don't turn down any work when they ask you to come in for the weekend which unfortuantely is the only way that the companies realise you are reliable.
DON'T get a job through an agency until you have atleast 5 years experience under ya belt for the reasons I stated earlier.
Good luck

Member Joined: Aug 09, 2007 Location: Thailand etc

Good advice from the oldtimers here (alzheimers???)
When I started out I took what was offered by the companies and then worked my way up , undercutting other more experienced guys is UNNACEPTABLE and will damge your future earnings as well as your workmates and make you a pariah.

Mido

You seem to have the right approach from the outset. Non confrontational, willing to listen and take guidance. You should fit from the outset. Good luck with the course. Thumb Up

With regard to acceptable trainee rates. There are day rates posted in the ROV Pay rates section of the Forum. Rates do vary from company to company. The golden rule is to check that you are on the same rate as other people working in the company you get your first job with. Not long after that, by listening on the job, you will discover what all the rates are with that particular company. If you are offered a job and are uncertain that the rate is correct ask. There will be someone on here working for that company that will know one way or another.

Also, whilst on then course I am sure the topic of rates will come up so you'll get some idea from that as well. Suggested rates on the course may be pumped up a little to make the whole deal seem more attractive. After the course it will most likely be a hard slog to get your first slot but I am sure you may be aware of that already.

As a reminder to all though. Never offer to undercut to get your first job.

Member Joined: Dec 15, 2008

Thx a lot James, what u said is correct enough yet realistic, the last thing a newbie guy like me in the industry need is a pessimistic vision from the old timers, I know that the offshore reality is full of shit, but on the other hand you guys know that the day rates in this industry is by far better than onshore and somehow it deserves this whole shit, anyway guys I’m stepping into where you are now, I’ll work my ass to add value to this industry, and not to lag it, and to be on the same track you’re on right now , please help me out on my very first steps, thank u again James

Member Joined: Dec 18, 2008 Location: Jockland

Lets not start any panic yet! Its not as if the industry is going to dry up soon. I'm sure some companies will take advantage of the economical situation to - well take advantage! Keep plugging away - the work is out there and if you are a good hand or potentially a good hand then you will eventually get some work. There is a lot of worry at the moment, dont let it put you off. Dont sell yourself short also. This is not the end! Have a look around the web, the subsea industry is doing fine. Just because the UK is having an economical ulcer - it isnt terminal! Its a big world out there! Its probably the guys who are scared of being 'found out' when their value is questioned that are worrying - time for some fresh legs? Good luck! Some 'Old timers' welcome fresh input (old habits die hard!)
Regards
RTFM

Member Joined: Dec 15, 2008

you're right RTFM,i shouldnt panic,i'll take the ROV course in Fort William and i'm already an electronics engineer,and i'll cut my way through this industry,and with good intentions and hard working,i know i'll make it

Member Joined: Aug 09, 2007 Location: Thailand etc

mido wrote:

you're right RTFM,i shouldnt panic,i'll take the ROV course in Fort William and i'm already an electronics engineer,and i'll cut my way through this industry,and with good intentions and hard working,i know i'll make it

Spot on MIDO ....be patient , hard working and proactive and you will be OK...good luck !

Member Joined: Dec 15, 2008

thx my brother,and i promise all of u guyz that i'll do my best to be an addition to this industry and not as mentioned in other threads that most newbies r a pain in the ass

Member Joined: Oct 22, 2008

Hi all,

I have noticed a bad trend in the last year (probably was around before then, but now quite apparent) of trainees working for free (own choice with ROV companies approval but with trainee services billed to the client) in order to get work and experience. I have worked with three-such guys in 2008 already and all they had to their name was a Fort William certificate 9ROV and full-house technical training).

This is really bad and I wont name the companies accepting this.

While I recognise the desperation of trainees to get work experience, this is not the way to do it and I really hope that this will be discouraged.

For those trainees doing it, at least be smart enough not to tell the other guys you are working with and dont be an idiot and bring it up in discussion with the client rep or Superintendent offshore, instead of making you look like a superhero, you will look like a nob and put your company in a bad light.

Anyone else had this or similar experiences?

Regards,

ROVER22

Member Joined: Dec 17, 2008 Location: West Oz

Hey Guys,
I am on the feb course at fremantle and there is no way i would undercut myself to get employment. I'll listen and take note of everything on course, and afterwards send out my CV to companies and keep hitting then up for employment and if i get a job, i'll take it. When i start i'll listen and learn, ask questions and make sure that im a valuable asset so i wont need to 'work for less.' Look forward to getting out there next year.

P.S. Any advice appreciated...

"P.S. Any advice appreciated..."

Put your training course on hold for at least 12 - 18 months now, so you can get some money back!

Member Joined: Dec 17, 2008 Location: West Oz

kangaroo wrote:

"P.S. Any advice appreciated..."

Put your training course on hold for at least 12 - 18 months now, so you can get some money back!

Is that cause 2009 is going to be a tough year? If i do it now i get time off from work and they pay some of the course fees. Also i got accepted and dont wanna miss my chance.