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I suppose i would join if they can arrange an agreement like the Divers have a wage structure


I'm sure they can arrange that but to do so they need memebrs before hand not after the event.

For the Uni0n to be able to negotiate an agreement they need to have enough ROV related members (P/Ts, Tooling Techs etc) already in the uni0n to bring the employers to the table. It is simply no good waiting for an agreement to be in place before you join. If everyone were to do that you could see what would happen if the uni0n went to the employers and had to admit that they don't represent anyone because they are waiting for an agreement to be in place before joining.

Just a quick point on the RMT v OILC. Although now affiliated under one uni0n (RMT) they are two slightly different animals. I believe the OILC branch of the RMT has a better handle on the Offshore O & G game overall which is why anyone joining the RMT should request to join that branch and not just be allocated to the nearest RMT branch to their home address which might be right next to (say) Victoria Station in London... you'd learn a lot about railways but not much offshore help there for sure!

best regards
James Mc
James Mc
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www.rovworld.com

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Innovator05 wrote:
Probably painting a Target on my back here, but I think it is a fundamental question that I cant see the answer to:

Which of the ROV Industry Major Players in the UK recognise the RMT for collective bargaining purposes?

Regards,
I5


On the ROV front I doubt if any do at present, but that would change in the same way it changed for the divers. When I was a diver we were in exactly the same position until the uni0n membership numbers swelled to the point where the companies had to recognise that the uni0n represented the bulk of the divers and therefore accepted the RMT for the purposes of collective bargaining.

For a number of years there was no diver recognition either but the steady trickle of divers joining the uni0n eventually counted. There were a number of fence sitters around in those days too, but eventually even they saw that it was the way forward and readily accepted the better rates, safety gear allowances, training allowances etc.

The UK ROV community need to learn from this because, to date, it has been a success story in the UK for the divers plus Oz and Norway for the divers and the ROV side of the industry. Why the UK ROV side is lagging on this I have no clue!

best regards
James Mc
James Mc
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www.rovworld.com

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James

There are some very valid reasons for joining the uni0n and the Divers are reaping the rewards of there possitive decision.... well done to them.

The Rov community on the other hand, will still be having this, should I, shouldn't I discussion well into the next recession. Nothing was learnt in the offshore slump of the 80s or the quiet period in the 90s, so why should it be any different now. For some strange reason, some Rov personnel seem to enjoy the regular peaks and troughs in the rate, the lack of security plus being treat like a second class citizen, so maybe change is not a benefit?
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Some good points there James

When i left School the RMT was at my work place there was information everywhere i was not allowed to join as only a Apprentice at that time and was not allowed to strike either.

There was information brochures people to speak too and they wanted the guys to join. they wanted the power and the subs

I got my Part One in 1997 i have looked on the RMT web site i could not get the info i wanted unless i was a Member.

If there was some guys giving information out like whats happening to try and get an agreement and sell the RMT membership maybe more guys would join there is a contact point here of at least 5000 workers.

Derek on Longstreath always gives out information on whats going on for the Divers.

How many guys here are RMT Members? do they get feed back on whats happening i would join and not wait for band wagon to roll if i knew some thing was being done same for many others here.
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Chief wrote:

Here's a list of organizations/actions. Anyone care to take a guess at which ones the RMT supports?

1)Womens abortion rights
2)The banning of domestic airline flights in the UK by the end of 2010
3)The Karl Marx Memorial Library
4)The support of Socialism
5)Free child care
6)Community service instead of prison sentences


All six of these organizations/causes the RMT supports. How does it support these groups? Either by teaming up with them or giving them money (i.e. your membership dues). I don't care who they support, the problem is that they are fast becoming a political engine jumping in bed with whatever cause might gain them more political pull. Most (almost all) of their political causes have nothing to do with any job that someone on this forum is involved in. That's why it's floundering and dieing a slow death on the vine. Maybe if they started representing the interests of ROV workers instead of wasting dues on some bullsh#t cause more people would join. They aren't any different than the uni0ns that are bringing down the auto industry...

Chief
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Once again, too many fence - sitters to make any difference including getting some bona fide teeth. Get off yur butts oh you people of the lousy weather regions and make a difference in numbers. It's only 15 pounds a month!!!!
I got your economic downturn right here!!!
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scotbeve wrote:
Once again, too many fence - sitters to make any difference including getting some bona fide teeth. Get off yur butts oh you people of the lousy weather regions and make a difference in numbers. It's only 15 pounds a month!!!!


Which is pretty cheap ..... The AB out on deck pays this each year and yet I sense that some people here appear concerned that it costs too much?
James Mc
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www.rovworld.com

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Yes James... I get that impression as well.... The mind boggles! BTW - I've received a GRAND TOTAL of 8 pm s concerning membership - once again, the mind boggles!!!!
I got your economic downturn right here!!!
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I did not say I would not pay because it was too expensive Confused
Insurance policies or the lottery I do every week , thankyou very much Shocked But at least I know what I would get if there was a screw up or I won the lottery , in other words I'm covered Cool
" What have the Romans ever done for us ?"
I also pay This crap government money off my hard earned tax for a supposed pension , ( If and when I ever retire Shocked Probably the government will up it to ninety , and what a puny shite amount it will be then , and I don't have much choice in the matter )
We also get promises from Governments about policies that they recant.
I don't want Runny Bullshite , I want something more solid from the RMT.
Give me something to chew on in stead of whiffs of poo Confused
Put ya brain in gear before ye open thy gob !
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Lost Dude,

Ya' buy a lottery or 2 a week, probably a few pints, so why not up the ante? As stated before, the RMT can't go to the table for a few dozen ROV guys... A few thousand perhaps... you being ex and related to the diving industry should be a major proponent to this way of thinking. You're well spoken and I think some of your N. Sea peers would listen to a word or 2 from yourself.... Like I said before, it's gotta start somewhere...... Agreed?
I got your economic downturn right here!!!
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ok following due consideration I will join when I get ashore.
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tc1 wrote:
ok following due consideration I will join when I get ashore.


Good going TC!! Even if it takes as long as one person an hour or 2 (I wish!!!!)

We need more of this... BTW - TC doesn't even live in the UK (but is ex....) . Sooooo, N. Sea Tigers - show us yer teeth. Or have you all been neutered?
I got your economic downturn right here!!!
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Gummed , Scott Very Happy
Gummed Laughing
Put ya brain in gear before ye open thy gob !
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Guys,

Good to see that there's a bit of a discussion going on here. There's no way I could make the points about the benefits of joining the uni0n more eloquently than James did in opening this thread, so I'm not going to try.

We are recruiting fast amongst ROVers (I've asked for the latest figures and I'll post them on the uni0n only page soon. We're recruiting very fast in Subsea7. Because when all is said and done it's not about individual preferences or even about this or that policy of the uni0n or perceived weakness etc. It's about the open warfare that breaks out when the employers believe they need to, or believe they can get away with, cutting costs and upping the rate of exploitation. That's what this debacle in SS7 is all about. And under these conditions we need to do what we need to do. Of course an individual may find a way round things - get a new job out of the industry maybe - step up to management maybe (though I believe there's a cull going on in the SS7 offices too) - but for most of us it's sink or swim together.

Our biggest strength - our numbers and our hands on control of the job - is also our biggest weakness. We (you) are spread throughout the world and over many vessels and are subject to all sort of divisive factors (individual preferences and dislikes - disinformation - bullying - fear of being victimised - hope that you'll be all right even if everyone else is on the road to hell in a handcart) - it's endless. Organising in the uni0n is the opposite of this - if you use it.

An ROVer attended the last OILC Branch meeting in Aberdeen on the 3rd of June. In response to his call for the branch to intervene and try and co-ordinate a fightback against Subsea7, the branch mandated me to do some quite specific things. What I'll do is post on the uni0n only forum and that way we'll keep this discussion inhouse.

If you're an RMT member, and you don't see the uni0n only forum as an option on this site, and you want to have access, email me on oilc.secretary@gmail.com, preferably with your membership number (but this is not always necessary). I'll check you out on the database and Ok the moderator to give you access.

If you're interested enough to be reading this but are not yet a member I urge you to join. The OILC Branch are going to be making an intervention at this year's RMT AGM with a view to turning the leadership of theunion towards a much higher profiled fight against the "sweetheart" deals that have kept us from establishing bargaining rights with the employers. We're also urging the union to take the lead in bringing the the two main Norwegian offshore uni0ns onboard with ourselves to make uni0nisation of the UK sector a priority. It's called "internationalism in practice not for holiday speeches"

If it's not exactly a life and death question that's being raised by Subsea7 at the moment, it'll certainly feel like it if they're allowed to lead a charge to the bottom with regards to pay rates throughout the industry.

Joining the OILC Branch (S100) of RMT will give you the opportunity to have an input into defending your job and your conditions. If you let Subsea7 carry through their agenda unchallenged you must already have a shrewd idea where it will lead.

regards

neil
OILC Branch Secretary
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ROV ROV ROV... The RMT may dine out on something else as well in future, but it was the divers that pulled it off (I was one) and there is no reason why ROV can't do the same as long as they are not plagued by a bunch of fence sitters of which there seems to be a fair few around in the ROV game.

Some fair comments but I will pick up on this bit.....

225 wrote:
However all this top secret, uni0n eyes only, keep it in house, hush-hush. Almost playground type behaviour doesn't really impress. Instead of making me want to join it does the exact opposit.


The companies operate in exactly the same way. They keep it in house and hush hush. Only those within the company have access to the plans being made. They make their plans behind closed doors and implement the policies when they feel the time is right. Often those moves catch people (like us) by surprise because things are generally well under way by the time they find out about it.

This builds a solid case for having a Union members only area of this Forum. But those reasons are not top secret and the information is accessible to any verified uni0n member. Those that do not join can't complain about something they are not a part of can they?

The reason for this approach is to prevent threads and posts being hijacked by non uni0n members that have one aim in mind and that is to circumvent any progress being made. So far it has worked admirably.

The next point I wish to make is that the OILC/RMT does not have a forum for ROV uni0n members but if they did you could pretty much guarantee access would be restricted to uni0n members only for the very same reasons. To prevent the companies from seeing what progress is being made.

You don't see the companies forecasting and discussing their strategies in the open because that would give their game away to all those with a vested interest in that knowledge. The same applies in both directions.

Or does anyone honestly think it a good idea to have just one open uni0n forum that all website visitors can read?

I, for one, clearly do not!

best regards
James Mc
James Mc
Site Admin
www.rovworld.com

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